Virtual Production Solutions

Hi all,

Again an open discussion: do you use internal compositing or external compositing and why?

We prefer to use external compositing.

Advantage: you have the least amount of delay (main reason). The clients complain about every frame of delay they get, so we try to keep that as low as possible. We have had it that clients canceled the virtual production and reverted to 'regular' production because of they fact that there would be a delay (which is more 'fear of the unknown' than anything else, but still). Also it is a bit easier to setup: no camera plane in Voyager, but just 2 sources (Voyager and camera) you combine in a keyer.

Disadvantage: you need to delay the camera to get it sync to the graphics, thus needing additional equipment. Also: you can't have 'in-engine' effects on the camera image, i.e. reflection of the camera image on the virtual surfaces and distortion of the camera image due to, for example, fire in front of the camera image.

For us, the advantage outweighs the disadvantages since we, thus far, never had to use fire (and effects alike) in front of the camera image. Also the reflection of the camera image on the virtual surface only works on certain positions of the talent (unless you use additional tracking to track the talent in the set so you can have UE4 move the camera plane accordingly).

I would love to hear your thoughts.

------------------------------
Gerard de Vries
Solution Architect Live Graphics & Virtual Graphics
United / EMG
The Netherlands
------------------------------

Hi Gerard,

I agree with you, the advantages definitely outweigh the disadvantages when comparing each side. Although the internal keyer (difference keyer) does a great job at extracting a clean key with detail and shadow, the external keyers will usually give you the extra parameters to refine the key even more.

I believe it also depends on the production budget as well. External keyers can add an extra cost in which the production might not need. 

Having a great Lighting Director could also help make the difference :)

I would love to hear other's thoughts as well!

------------------------------
Max Paiement
Product Specialist, Virtual Graphics
Ross
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 04-13-2021 05:54
From: Gerard de Vries
Subject: Internal or external compositing

Hi all,

Again an open discussion: do you use internal compositing or external compositing and why?

We prefer to use external compositing.

Advantage: you have the least amount of delay (main reason). The clients complain about every frame of delay they get, so we try to keep that as low as possible. We have had it that clients canceled the virtual production and reverted to 'regular' production because of they fact that there would be a delay (which is more 'fear of the unknown' than anything else, but still). Also it is a bit easier to setup: no camera plane in Voyager, but just 2 sources (Voyager and camera) you combine in a keyer.

Disadvantage: you need to delay the camera to get it sync to the graphics, thus needing additional equipment. Also: you can't have 'in-engine' effects on the camera image, i.e. reflection of the camera image on the virtual surfaces and distortion of the camera image due to, for example, fire in front of the camera image.

For us, the advantage outweighs the disadvantages since we, thus far, never had to use fire (and effects alike) in front of the camera image. Also the reflection of the camera image on the virtual surface only works on certain positions of the talent (unless you use additional tracking to track the talent in the set so you can have UE4 move the camera plane accordingly).

I would love to hear your thoughts.

------------------------------
Gerard de Vries
Solution Architect Live Graphics & Virtual Graphics
United / EMG
The Netherlands
------------------------------

Hi Max,

Thanks for your reply.

An additional plus of external compositing I didn't mention is that the vision engineer is still able to adjust the colors of the camera image (on the keyer after keying) when using a good chromakeyer and can keep on monitoring/adjusting the various signals while being live on air, as he/she would with a 'regular' camera. Especially useful when lighting conditions change for whatever reason. We have had that artificial blond hair gives a pinkish shine after chromakeying without modification.

The additional cost is an issue. However our rental price for the chromakeyer fortunately isn't that high.

------------------------------
Gerard de Vries
Solution Architect Live Graphics & Virtual Graphics
United / EMG
The Netherlands
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 05-03-2021 09:58
From: Max Paiement
Subject: Internal or external compositing

Hi Gerard,

I agree with you, the advantages definitely outweigh the disadvantages when comparing each side. Although the internal keyer (difference keyer) does a great job at extracting a clean key with detail and shadow, the external keyers will usually give you the extra parameters to refine the key even more.

I believe it also depends on the production budget as well. External keyers can add an extra cost in which the production might not need. 

Having a great Lighting Director could also help make the difference :)

I would love to hear other's thoughts as well!

------------------------------
Max Paiement
Product Specialist, Virtual Graphics
Ross

Original Message:
Sent: 04-13-2021 05:54
From: Gerard de Vries
Subject: Internal or external compositing

Hi all,

Again an open discussion: do you use internal compositing or external compositing and why?

We prefer to use external compositing.

Advantage: you have the least amount of delay (main reason). The clients complain about every frame of delay they get, so we try to keep that as low as possible. We have had it that clients canceled the virtual production and reverted to 'regular' production because of they fact that there would be a delay (which is more 'fear of the unknown' than anything else, but still). Also it is a bit easier to setup: no camera plane in Voyager, but just 2 sources (Voyager and camera) you combine in a keyer.

Disadvantage: you need to delay the camera to get it sync to the graphics, thus needing additional equipment. Also: you can't have 'in-engine' effects on the camera image, i.e. reflection of the camera image on the virtual surfaces and distortion of the camera image due to, for example, fire in front of the camera image.

For us, the advantage outweighs the disadvantages since we, thus far, never had to use fire (and effects alike) in front of the camera image. Also the reflection of the camera image on the virtual surface only works on certain positions of the talent (unless you use additional tracking to track the talent in the set so you can have UE4 move the camera plane accordingly).

I would love to hear your thoughts.

------------------------------
Gerard de Vries
Solution Architect Live Graphics & Virtual Graphics
United / EMG
The Netherlands
------------------------------