Graphics

So... I have a graphite, with Graphite Xpression and Studio upgrade on it.
Meaning we do have Transition logic etc available. We also have Tessera installed and so far it's been working beutifully, but with a few bugs...

So, I'm working on creating some graphics for our LED screen in our arena. Showing simple graphics like Versus, some instagram stuff and statistics etc... And I want them to have their own IN animation and their own OUT animation.

I've done several of these before, so I figured this shouldnt be a big problem having them come in one after the other and have the one online animate out, before the next one animates in. One would think that's no problem right? Appereantly I was wrong...

https://youtu.be/fWq1T1X5ZGw

So, the scene on their own works just fine, take online, and it animates in. Take offline and it animates out.
However, take another scene (same layer and same framebuffer/Tessera mapping) online, and the first one will animate out, but the second will "cut" in after the amount of time it SHOULD have been animating in.

Am I missing something in the transition logic here? Or is this another Tessera bug?
I'd think this one was quite easy, simply checking the "wait for out animation" in the transition logic...

Hi Aleksander - I don't have experience with the Tessera product, but I'm wondering if your IN scene director for your second scene has it's playhead is parked in a position that isn't at the start of your scene director? I know I've run into weird playback issues when I've modified my SD and forgot the reset my SD's playhead afterward. If that's not the case, I'd be happy to take a look at your project to see if there's anything that jumps out at me. 

Well, I took a look at the playheads, and yes, you were right in your little hunch, they werent all at the start...

However, I reset them to frame 0000 to se if that helped, but nope, still same issue.
If you got an email for me to send it to you I'd be happy to.
Remember, you have to enable Tessera under "Edit -> Tessera -> Settings" and also choose the "Use Region Maps from Projects". That way you will get the correct region mapping etc following the project file (Designer has Tessera included).

And yeah, alot of the project relies on external images and/or DataLinq, so I dont think you'll get the most out of it, but the corners should be just fine as they are.

Hi Aleksander,
You can reach me at bill.meems@gmail.com. I'll take a look at your project and let you know if I see anything jump out at me. 

On its way!

If anyone else wanna take a look, give me a call and I'll let you in on it.

Hey Aleksander,

I took a look at your project, and it made no sense that the transition logic didn't honour the playback of the outgoing transition before it ran the incoming transition for the scene you were going to in your sequencer. I'm still not 100% sure why it doesn't do that, and ultimately we may need to get the heavy hitters involved in that. What I did do is a combination of a little tweaking of your incoming scene director for your VS scene, as it is set to start with its background at 100% opacity. Because it seems like the outgoing transition isn't being played out before the incoming transition plays, I set your VS scene to start at 0% opacity, which mimics the 100% to 0% opacity transition your other corner scene is doing on its outgoing transition. I also added to the Back-to-Back condition of your transition logic rule so that the incoming scene renders on top. Again, this may only be a bandaid solution, and there may be a better way to manage what you are attempting to do, which is get the transition logic to respect the incoming and outgoing transitions for each scene. 

I've uploaded a screen capture of the end result to show you what that looks like. You'll find that preview here: B2B with In and Out working

I'm interested in hearing the feedback from some of the other folks who've tackled this issue as well, in part to better understand the nuances of Transition Logic but to also validate whether there is an issue within the program which cause limits the recognition of a scene's outgoing transition when TL is being used between two or more scenes. 

Or you can check "Play out when incoming cuts" - because you are making a CUT between take items + check "Wait for out effect"- because the next scene have to wait the current item to play the out transition and then start.

Yeah <x-zendesk-user data-user-name="Rosca Gabriel">372662433612</x-zendesk-user>, that's not the problem here...
I dont want the "out" on the first to play while the second animates in.

I want the first one to animate out, THEN the second one to animate in. The issue here is not the out animation, as that one behaves as expected, but the in animation of the second one just ignores the animation, but it doesnt "cut" in until after a set amount of time (no idea how long).

I've basically done exactly as described here:
https://youtu.be/O8xzn8yGioY?t=309 (Ross Xpression U Transition Logic, starting at 5:09)

And it does not behave as it should be. Anyone from ROSS case to chime in on this one? As this does NOT make sense to me at all!

Looking even more at it, it's like it doesnt acknowledge the animation at all, because the background is still there, even after the first scene has ended, the red background stays. However there is no animation of keyframes until it's all "done", and then it cuts online.

Yes, for both scene check the "Play out when incoming cuts" and "Wait for out effect".
Also use rule (for both scene): Check Other Scene is "This Scene" and "Invert Condition".

Well <x-zendesk-user data-user-name="Rosca Gabriel">372662433612</x-zendesk-user>, just for fun, I tried. And it did not work, same problem as before.

1. "Play out when incomming cuts" would be to cut something on, but still have an animation in the back. I want this to animate out before it's relevant, so that checkbox while there, should actually make no sense, since the second scene would have the "Wait for out effect" checked, meaning the out animation would allready be done before the second scene even starts animating in.
   
   
2. Basically all that rules does is to set the animation in/out if it's not the same scene being called. That's all good and fair, but that's basically what Xpression does by default allready. Meaning it's a reduntant rule and actually brings next to nothing of value into the transition logic in what I'm trying to do here.

But yes, I tried your sollution, still does not work.
Thing is, if I make a new project, and try to do it with two new scenes, it works perfectly the way I've been trying to do this... Meaning there has to be something with either both, or one of those two scenes.

I think I got it! (watching again your movie)
Do you use Video Files filling the red quad?
I you are using Video Files with Auto Start > Yes it will auto start as soon the scene is on line and you will lose the intro part.
You have to control the video files with Scene Director.

Nope, no video...
Since last time I even tried to redo the scenes inside the project, making sure all bugs and errors with scene director and animation controllers was no longer an issue if there ever was one.

But nope, the problem still persists... meaning I'm gonna go ahead and contact support directly. I simply cannot find the problem with this thing.

OK, if you can please share the project with us in order to make some tests.

So, I stripped it down to the absolute bare minimum of materials, images, fonts, scenes. I removed the Tessera (as problem is still there without it...) and I've basically remade the scenes as well.

This just does not want to cooperate.

Download Xpression package here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IHkct3mKcRASn3IAcPN0VL-Zy7K7Lgk9/view?usp=sharing

Individually the scenes themselfs work just fine. There's no problem at all if you try to take a scene online, then offline. They behave as expected then. But if you try to take one after the other, the scene that IS online animates out, and the scene you are taking online, will just cut into existance, but not before it has spent some time showing just the background.

I got it!
You have to clean the screen at the end of out transition.
1. Use different Animation Controller for In and Out (you can create a copy)
2. In Scene Out, animation controller Out, on the last but one frame add visibility on for LayerObject1
3. In Scene Out, animation controller Out, on last frame add visibility off for LayerObject1

Do the same with the second take item.

Huh? I'm not sure I understand?
And while I would be greatly appreciative if you found a sollution (will definetly try), this seems more of a workaround of a bug to be honest.

Could you upload an example package for me?

The outgoing scene continues to be rendered on air while the IN animation of the second scene is running.  So the out animation of the first scene would need to make sure it transitions the background to be invisible as part of it's OUT scene director; otherwise it will totally cover up the INcoming scene.  The outgoing scene renders on top.

If you create two simple scenes with animated quads in different color (not fullscreen) and run those in transition logic you'll see at what point each scene comes on and goes off and which is on-top, and this might help clear up what is happening.

<x-zendesk-user data-user-name="Rosca Gabriel">372662433612</x-zendesk-user> well, it worked! Thanks a ton!
<x-zendesk-user data-user-name="Brian Ford">372361507432</x-zendesk-user> yeah I guess, I did try the same thing with two simple animated quads and got somewhat the same result.

I am still gonna file this as a "bug" though, as this completly defeats the purpose of the "wait for out animation" and not to mention the "reverse direction" option on an animation controller within a scene director.
This way, no matter what, I would have to create two different animation controllers (with just transparancy as one change), regardless if i want just the reverse in animation as my out animation.

Yeah I can copy/paste in an animation controller and just make that "work", but it's still wrong within the logic of it all. I do guess it somehow makes "sense" in the fact that in normal use, you'd ususally not have the background there, meaning it wouldnt usually overlap.

Anyways, thanks a ton Rosca for pointing me in the right direction! This at least gives me the chance to set up a timed group for our arena! :D

I'm sorry for this delay...
Link: https://www.dropbox.com/s/23hzs9j6a64cenh/Animate%20In%20Is%20working%20fine.xpp?dl=0 

No worries <x-zendesk-user data-user-name="Rosca Gabriel">372662433612</x-zendesk-user>, I understood what you ment earlier, and I got it to work the way you said.
As I mention above, it does seem like somewhat of an unusual sollution, but at least it works now so I can continue working on other parts as well.